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The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Once I went and actually looked at my January reads, choosing the #worstof2021 was easy. Mists of Avalon certainly took the cake. I get that people love this book/series, but I just couldn‘t abide the sex with children thing. Dishonourable mentions go to Cunt, The Vagina Bible, and The Penis Book. @Texreader @Butterfinger

Chrissyreadit That‘s sad. I would have hoped for more from nonfiction resources. 6mo

GingerAntics @Chrissyreadit there are, they‘re just not the ones you would hope for. There doesn‘t seem to be a good book about the actual parts themselves. Although many of the other choices have a section on the parts so it all works out in the end, I guess. 🤷🏼‍♀️ 6mo

Butterfinger Totally agree. I threw out my copy. I didn't know and I appreciated you sharing. 6mo

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TrishB I read the Bradley in my teens and loved it. I only found out the details of her and her husband later 😢 6mo

GingerAntics @TrishB I want to say I would have liked it without that knowledge, but I know too much of all the crap she screwed up and didn‘t even try to get right. I was annoyed with the book before the fateful chapter that ended it all. 6mo

GingerAntics @Butterfinger I have a digital copy. I‘m trying to figure out how to get rid of it. 6mo

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perfectsinner

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Surprise #bookmail from a dear friend 🥰📚
The Heretic's Daughter, Kathleen Kent
The Mists of Avalon, Marion Zimmer Bradley
The Elegance of the Hedgehog, Muriel Barbery
Migrations, Charlotte McConaghy

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Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

If Morgaine would just shut up every once in a while this book wouldn't be so infernally long.

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The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

This post contains spoilers

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Oh snap, Morgaine about to go all Rumpelstiltskin on Elaine's bebe!

PatriciaU 😂 My husband is annoyed at my burst of laughter! 10mo

zombiehooters Tell him I'm sorry! 😂😂😂 10mo

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The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Just sitting here waiting for Gwenhwyfar to stop being such a sanctimonious twat.

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The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#GirlPower ♀️

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AllisonM89

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

pick

So many thoughts and feelings about this book. There's parts of this book that I adore. There's parts of this book that I struggle with. I'm so so happy to finally have read this one.

#bookspinbingo @thearomaofbooks

TheAromaofBooks Woohoo!! 1y

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AllisonM89

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

This might be my third time starting this book. Both other times i started reading it, i enjoyed it, but didn't have the time to finish it. I really need to actually read the entire book this time 😅

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InLibrisVeritas @4thhouseontheleft @ABooksyGirl @ahackett @amyg @Ashley_Nicoletto @BarbaraTheBibliophage @BethM @Bturner588 @Bookgirl @bookwormAHN @bookandcat @Captain22 @cewilf @cherinium @Chrissyreadit @cobwebmoth @CoffeeK8 @coffeewithbooks @DannyHattan @debiw781 @DuckOfDoom @eanderson @eri.reads @erhibiscus @Eyelit @Fantasyfan @Gezemice @grrlbrarian @HufflepuffGirl90 @InBooksILive 1y

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

This post contains spoilers

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#BBBBC

And the last set of questions!

InLibrisVeritas @janjan @jazzfeathers @jpmcwisemorgan @Lesanne @leshamac @lildeb_8 @LittleBug @madamereginald @manifestsanity @MeganAnn @miralunasbooknook @mreads @mutlee @Nute @OnePageAtATime @phatsallylee @ReadingBetween @Riveted_Reader_Melissa @RJHowe @SamAnne @Schnoebs @sebrittain @shaunseay @Shadowfat @SherylRC @Soscha
@sophoclessweetheart @swatreads

@thearcherisagirl @thereadingunicorn @TheRomantiCate @TK421 @tonyahoswalt 1y

Gezemice 7. I guess the most surprising was the Merlin becoming Christian and that whole terrible punishment. I also did not like how evil Mordred turned out. Vivian being slain just like that seemed also rather contrived. Lancelot going mad was weird. But the one I am not sure about is, did she imply that the reason Gwen never had children was that Morgause was giving her herbs to prevent it? That was not quite clear to me. 1y

Gezemice 8. Not really. This is an epic where most scenes are part of the whole. 9. No. While I am glad I have read it, the story was ended and the style does not make me want to read another, especially after I found out about the author. 1y

InLibrisVeritas @Gezemice I was unclear in Gwen's inability to have children too. It was said a few times they could both have children, and then with people saying she could not be allowed a child. It definitely felt like someone was interfering. 1y

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The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

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#BBBBC

The second set of questions for you!
I will post the 3rd set immediatly so be on the look out for those as well.

Gezemice 4. I think that was great, but the author definitely was biased toward paganism and women, but I must say with good cause, as usually there isn‘t even a discussion on those aspects, or are plainly treated as evil, like Guinevere and the priests keep doing. At the end, she brings them together though, and finds place for women and the Goddess in the worship of the Virgin Mary. (edited) 1y

Gezemice 5. See previous - the Goddess lives in the Virgin Mary. However that rather simplifies it as the society becoming male dominant and women being relegated to subservient role is not addressed by Virgin worship, and the book glosses over this. (edited) 1y

Gezemice 6. Oh, I think the point of the book was to address the tough issues of sexuality, sin, religion, women‘s roles, mothers, etc. They weren‘t just plot points. She actually had to work quite hard to put her themes into the framework of the Arthurian legends. Like using the Grail story to show that the Goddess and God are the same. Or using Gwen and Lancelot‘s love to bring about Gwen‘s character development. 1y

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InLibrisVeritas @4thhouseontheleft @ABooksyGirl @ahackett @amyg @Ashley_Nicoletto @BarbaraTheBibliophage @BethM @Bturner588 @Bookgirl @bookwormAHN @bookandcat @Captain22 @caroline2 @CBee @cewilf @cherinium @Chrissyreadit @cobwebmoth @CoffeeK8 @coffeewithbooks @DannyHattan @debiw781 @DuckOfDoom @eanderson @eri.reads @erhibiscus @Eyelit @Fantasyfan @Gezemice @grrlbrarian @HufflepuffGirl90 @inbooksILive 1y

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#BBBBC

The first set of questions are ready to go! Feel free to answer and discuss here or make your own post (pls include the tag so we can find it!)

Also if you did not read Mists but are tagged below, let me know and I'll take you off the discussion list. That way I won't bug you the next two days 😊

Caroline2 I bailed after the author controversy. I tried to carry on reading as I was absolutely loving the book but I couldn‘t get past it. 😔 so yeah, take me off the list please. 👍 1y

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InLibrisVeritas @Caroline2 No problem! I completely understand 💕 1y

CBee You can take me off the list as well! Thank you! 1y

InLibrisVeritas @CBee No problem! 1y

Gezemice Wow, no one has read this and you put so much effort into the questions! I am so sorry! I have listened to this - it came in 4 parts and it was close to 60 hours... it was an engrossing read, even if it was slow mostly in the middle. And it was also quite depressing as the progression was from full power of Avalon and Arthur to a gradual decline and fall of the old ways and Arthur‘s court. 1y

Gezemice 1. Overall I enjoyed it, and especially that it was from the women‘s point of view. We learn these legends all from the male point of view, and women are in the background - this reversed that. I also liked the reversal of the religion issue - how Christianism represses women and sexuality in general, and that is the opposite of the druidism and Goddess worship, which is also close to nature. 1y

Gezemice 2. Yes, I was generally familiar, and recently listened to Le Morte d‘Arthur, which I enjoyed mainly due to the great narration. I don‘t know too much of the other legends. For instance, the Grail story is not in it as far as I remember. 1y

Gezemice 3. Yes! I loved that everything was from one or other woman‘s point of view, and women‘s homes and spaces were the locations. We learned a lot of what they were doing. I must say I would have preferred a bit less of Morgaine spinning or weaving or what have you, and have her return to Avalon much earlier. Gunievere also grated on me, I think that was intentional, that she went from being afraid to be outside to loving it. 1y

InLibrisVeritas @Gezemice It's quite alright! I figured this dicussion would be kind of sparse ❤ I absolutely agree about Morgaine and Gwen, especially Gwen. She was an interesting character bc of her double standards but it made reading her pov so frustrating 1y

Gezemice @InLibrisVeritas Absolutely. She was definitely there to show Christian fanatism but also how much of it came from her insecurity. Like she wanted to appease God so she could bear children. 1y

Gezemice @InLibrisVeritas Also, about the controversy, I looked up the author AFTER I finished, so that rather soured my view on her, and wish I did not know that. At the same time the work speaks for itself and it is a very good one but way too long I think. 1y

InLibrisVeritas @Gezemice Yeah I doubt I will be reading more from Bradley. I found out beforehand so it made some things kind of uncomfortable. Gwen's need to manipulate Arthur really bothered me. I got where she was coming from but to use shared trauma like that just hit wrong. 1y

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Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

I'm not sure how many are still reading this one with us #BBBBC, but I just wanted to check in again and see how the progress is going?

I have a little less than 200 pages left, snd hoping to finish it up very soon.

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Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#BBBBC

For those reading Mists, how is it treating you?

I personally am finding it really slow but I am making process.

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InLibrisVeritas @4thhouseontheleft @ABooksyGirl @ahackett @amyg @AnansiGirl @Angeles @Ashley_Nicoletto @BarbaraTheBibliophage @BethM @BrittanyReads @Bturner588 @Bookgirl @bookwormAHN @bookandcat @Captain22 @caroline2 @CBee @cewilf @cherinium @Chrissyreadit @cobwebmoth @CoffeeK8 @coffeewithbooks @daena @DannyHattan @debiw781 @DuckOfDoom @eanderson @eri.reads @erhibiscus @Eyelit @Fantasyfan @Gezemice @grrlbrarian @HufflepuffGirl90 @InBooksILive 1y

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Hey #BBBBC guys!

I wanted to do a post on the content of Mists of Avalon, as well as the actions the author. That way you can make a more informed decision as to if you will read this, and not be caught off guard

The book contains graphic depictions of abuse towards animals and children. A long with harmful language towards other races, genders, and sexualities.

The author has been accused of child abuse/molestation, along with her husband.

InLibrisVeritas @IndoorDame @janjan @jazzfeathers @jpmcwisemorgan @Laughterhp @Lesanne @leshamac @lildeb_8 @LittleBug @madamereginald @manifestsanity @MeganAnn @miralunasbooknook @mreads @mutlee @Nute @OnePageAtATime @phatsallylee @ReadingBetween @Riveted_Reader_Melissa @RJHowe @SamAnne @Schnoebs @sebrittain @shaunseay @Shadowfat @SherylRC @Soscha
@sophoclessweetheart @swatreads 1y

InLibrisVeritas
@thearcherisagirl @thereadingunicorn @TheRomantiCate @TheSpineView @TK421 @tonyahoswalt @wanderinglynn 1y

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Laughterhp Wow, thanks for posting that. I had no idea. I don‘t do well with reading about animal harm.. and wow, about the author... (edited) 1y

CBee I read this years ago before I knew about the author 😕 Was shocking to say the least. 1y

Laughterhp I will unfortunately, probably skip this book as I don‘t want to support the author in anyway. 1y

Read-y_Picker Thank you for posting this info. Can I please be tagged for the next book?Thank you! 1y

wanderinglynn I will skip this book as I do not wish to support this author. 1y

AnansiGirl Thank you for sharing this. I‘ve already made up my mind to skip TMoA. I read it in my late teens and was stunned by the content and how well loved it was among the pagan community. As for the allegations I became aware of those too via Colleen Doran‘s defunct blog years ago. 1y

GingerAntics Her husband actually died in prison for sex abuse of a child (under the age of 14, in public, while threatening bodily harm, etc). 1y

daena I will pass on this one. 1y

Schnoebs Thanks for the information. I‘m definitely going to have to think on this one. I was planning on picking it up next month but now I‘m not too sure. 1y

BrittanyReads Thank you for your transparency about the book! I haven't been able to participate in the book club,.would you kindly remove me from tags? Thank you! And thanks for offering a fun and well run club! I hope I can rejoin down the road! 1y

Riveted_Reader_Melissa @Laughterhp and @wanderinglynn I‘ll probably skip now too, but if it matters, according to Wikipedia, all the proceeds from her backlist books now goes to save the children charities. The author passed away. (edited) 1y

Riveted_Reader_Melissa Thanks for letting us know, I don‘t know if I‘ll read it now or not...ugh. I got mine used, so I didn‘t support the author, plus according to Wikipedia the proceeds now go to children‘s charities... but I‘m still iffy on the books content now. 🤷‍♀️ 1y

Bookgirl Appreciate the heads up although I already knew all of it. I read this long ago and absolutely loved it. I don‘t recall the abuse in the book being upsetting but it was over 20 years ago so 🤷🏼‍♀️🤷🏼‍♀️The allegations of child abuse came out much later and shocked me like everyone else. @Riveted_Reader_Melissa glad to know proceeds go to children‘s charities. Something positive! 1y

wanderinglynn @Riveted_Reader_Melissa that‘s at least positive. Thanks for sharing that. But I‘ll still pass. Certain topics, like child abuse, I just won‘t do. I worked in child dependency court for 3 years and saw far too much to want to read about it, even in a fantasy book. 1y

Riveted_Reader_Melissa @wanderinglynn Well it was Wikipedia, so take that for what it‘s worth. But I agree, my to-read list is miles long, it can handle some thinning with good cause. I just took Ann Perry off my list too, she‘d mentioned in another thread where they were discussing this book and has a totally different, but equally sordid backstory. 🙄 1y

wanderinglynn @Riveted_Reader_Melissa Yes, Anne Perry‘s backstory is sordid, but a bit more forgivable since she was a child, served time for her crime, and presumably hasn‘t committed any crimes since. 1y

Riveted_Reader_Melissa @wanderinglynn very true, second chances and turned her life around apparently. 1y

bookandcat I have a friend's copy that I borrowed long before allegations came to light. May try it so I can be educated about it especially since I don't have to technically support with money or put it through library circulation, but I am on the fence in general and definitely not committed to this one. 1y

bookandcat I will also have to see if my friend wants her book back because I borrowed it, uh, probably more than 15 years ago 1y

TheSpineView I will skip this time too. I don't have a copy and I don't want to read or support this book. I appreciate you being proactive in letting us know about the issues. 1y

Angeles When the author is dead I generally would read the book because unlike with a live author, my reading/buying the book wouldn't benefit a creep.However, the type of fantasy with arthurian leyends or fairy tale rewriting is not my cup of tea and I had already decided to pass on this book 1y

InLibrisVeritas @BrittanyReads I have removed you! And you are welcome back anytime 1y

InLibrisVeritas @Read-y_Picker I have added you to the group list for notifications! 1y

InLibrisVeritas I think I removed everyone who said they would pass on this one! For those on the fence, I have kept you on the list for now but as always feel free to let me know at anytime if you want that to change ❤️ 1y

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Caroline2

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

I am deeply disturbed to find out the author of the book I am currently reading was a child abuser! I was loving this book. I admit, the scene with the blue girl didn‘t register with me, clearly I skim read that part but seeing it now in a different light. 🥺 This article perfectly sums it up:

https://electricliterature.com/the-book-that-made-me-a-feminist-was-written-by-a...

Palimpsest Yes, sorry. I saw that a lot of people were going to read this book together which had been on my to read list for years, but there is no way I could ever read it after knowing she sexually abused her daughter and others. I was torn about saying something. I‘ve read that it is one of the best retelling of Arthurian legend/ celts, something I‘ve been interested in for a long time, but I refuse to read it. Others will have to decide if the can 👇 1y

Palimpsest Separate the work from the author herself. I for one can‘t do it. 1y

BethM Wow 1y

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Kdgordon88 Thank you for sharing this article. I am one of the ones that haven‘t yet read it and was going to...not anymore. My copy is going in the trash. @Palimpsest 1y

AmyG I have a copy somewhere. I won‘t read it. 1y

MsMelissa I adore this book, and read it before I knew anything about the author. Once I learned about Zimmer Bradley I elected to forego reading any of her other works. 1y

Jerdencon I read this years ago- and had no idea. How horrible! 1y

MsMelissa @Palimpsest it is hard to separate the person from the product. This is one of my favourite books, but I read it long before I knew anything about the author. I decided not to read any of her other books. Anne Perry is another author whose works I won‘t read because of her actions, but I know a lot of people love her books. 1y

Caroline2 @Kdgordon88 @Palimpsest My copy is also going in the bin! 🗑 1y

Caroline2 @Book_Fiend_Melissa @Jerdencon it is such a shame and I‘m absolutely gutted as I‘m about 30% in and loving it but how can I keep reading now. 😔 1y

kellock I just had to look up Anne Perry. I had no idea! 1y

GingerAntics @Palimpsest it‘s actually not even accurate on either of those two points, really. The whole thing is rubbish. 1y

GingerAntics This was one of the first articles I read, actually. It‘s really well done. This topic is also a complete Google rabbit hole. I spent a day just reading about it. 1y

Palimpsest @GingerAntics I think I‘ll eventually just read Le Morte D‘arthur. 1y

KatieDid927 @Palimpsest Agreed. Not a book I‘ll ever pick up. 1y

Buechersuechtling Thanks for sharing this. 🙇🏽‍♀️ I head no idea. Not until just now. Which means, also not 2017 when I audiobooked it. I agree with Jessica Jernigan about interpreting the quoted scene in the context of the rest of the scene. I didn‘t remember it, nor did I take umbrage to it. I‘m kind of glad that I bailed on “Web of Light” and therefore skipped all her other books. 1y

Clare-Dragonfly I loved and love this book, though I‘m not sure if I‘ve read it since I learned that the author was an abuser. But when I did—it saddened but did not surprise me. It‘s not just the scene with the blue girl. The way Viviane wields Morgaine‘s sexuality as a tool for her machinations makes sense, too. I won‘t give MZB‘s estate any more money, but I will probably read Mists again and get new things out of it, like I have every other time. 1y

Clare-Dragonfly @Palimpsest There are so many great Arthurian books you can read without slogging through Middle English (though that is also fun)! I highly recommend Mary Stewart‘s Merlin series! 1y

Palimpsest @Clare-Dragonfly Thank you for the recommendation! 1y

Riveted_Reader_Melissa @kellock I didn‘t know about Ann Perry either! OMG 1y

Andrea4 I read the book and then found out and when I did I quite literally chucked the book at a wall and said something along the lines of "she can go to fucking hell"... 1y

Caroline2 It‘s such a shame. I was really enjoying this book but I just can‘t keep reading now. 😔 1y

Jeg Wow. 1y

82 likes23 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

bailed

It has taken me nearly 24 hours to be able to compose comments on this so called book that isn‘t just a string of expletives. As someone who experienced some of what children experienced at the hands of this author and her husband, what characters in this book experienced, it has been a really rough 24 hours for me. I am sorry I ever purchased or attempted to read this trash. (Review below in comments)

Texreader, TrishB, julesG, Bookwomble

GingerAntics I vehemently oppose censorship, but I just might make an exception for this book. This book is appalling. Chapter 15 was the deal breaker for me. Forget conflating Wicca and Celtic spiritual practice. Forget her utter lack of knowledge of the period she‘s supposedly writing about. 👇🏻👇🏻👇🏻 1y

GingerAntics Chapter 15 contains both child sexual abuse AND coerced incest between minors. We could potentially have a conversation about a 15 or 16 year old being an adult in this time period IF the 15 or 16 year old character wasn‘t repeatedly and exclusively referred to as “girl” and “child.” 👇🏻👇🏻👇🏻 (edited) 1y

GingerAntics Yes, in that period she would have been referred to as a woman, but Bradley made the choice to call her a child, so clearly two children having incestuous sex was her intent. An even younger child referred to as a “little girl” was forced to have sex with an “old hunter” and Bradley called it an “irresistible force of nature.” 👇🏻👇🏻👇🏻 1y

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GingerAntics This is a perfect example of how art imitates life. I‘m generally open minded about separating the creator from the creation, but that open mindedness ends at abuse, especially of children. 👇🏻👇🏻👇🏻 1y

GingerAntics Had I known about this author‘s child abuse, I never would have even purchased the book. I‘m sorry I gave my money to Bradley‘s sick “lover” and apologist who is now making money off of the sale of these books while claiming Bradley‘s actions and those of her husband were totally okay. #MarionZimmerBradley #TheMistsOfAvalon #SciFiFantasyBookClub #BBBBC 1y

TrishB Hope you‘re ok ❤️ 1y

Texreader That‘s rough and I would feel similarly. Is there any way to return it? 1y

GingerAntics @TrishB I‘m actually okay. I found my voice in this, moved from pure rage and hurt to a place I could use appropriate words after reading Moira‘s poetry. She‘s a lovely poet. I‘m looking to see if she‘s published a collection I can get my hands on. 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader I can‘t remember when I bought it. It was ages ago. 2016 some time I think. I would gladly return it if I thought I could. I‘ve just banished it from my iPad and my Apple account. 1y

Branwen I'm so sorry, friend 😔 1y

Bookwomble @GingerAntics I'm sorry you were exposed to Bradley's awful abusive nature, and pleased that you found your voice and self-agency 💖 If you find a volume of Moira's poetry, please tag me. For anyone reading this who might need support, this is a link to the website of NAPAC, the National Association for People Abused in Childhood: https://napac.org.uk 1y

Eggbeater Thank you for saying something. I had a similar start in life and would not have wanted to read this either. I'm sorry, that is really shitty. 1y

julesG I'm sending a big hug to you. I've told you, I read the book a good 20 years ago and it didn't sit well with me back then - but I'm . Thank you for your honest review, I feel the same about the book. 1y

julesG Hit send too soon (twice). Just wanted to write that I'm glad that we are more aware of what we are reading and call people/authors out. 1y

Centique I just went down an internet rabbit hole reading about all this. I had no idea. Plenty of proof of much of it as well in the husbands trial. 🤯 I‘ve never read Marion Zimmer Bradley and I certainly never will now. Thank you for bringing this up. 1y

GingerAntics @Bookwomble America sucks so much more. Half of Americans say we‘re just whiners and we got what we deserved. 1y

GingerAntics @Eggbeater I‘m glad I could prevent someone else from stumbling upon the troubling nature of this book and it‘s author. Honestly, it‘s rather boring, then all of a sudden it‘s gone bad. 1y

GingerAntics @julesG I actually saw a video on YouTube about the daughter‘s memoir and apparently when Bradley‘s husband was banned from a SFF convention for poedophelia, people were upset, and that was in 99. It‘s amazing how different the world is just 21 years later. 1y

GingerAntics @Centique it certainly is a rabbit hole. There is the evidence from the husband‘s trial. There is Bradley‘s deposition. There is her girlfriend‘s deposition. There were other people who knew. It‘s shocking how many people knew and just thought 🤷🏼‍♀️. 🤯 1y

GingerAntics @Branwen thanks! I‘m just glad I found Moira‘s own words on the matter early on. I‘m trying to figure out how to sure the beautiful and raw poem she wrote called “Mother‘s Hands.” That one really clicked with me. It‘s long, but I‘m working on how to get it all in. 1y

GingerAntics @Bookwomble I haven‘t found anything other than her memoir yet, but it‘s showing one of the poems under a pen name. She‘s a talented harpist and vocalist, so maybe that‘s what she‘s spent her life dedicated to, and the poetry is just for herself. I‘ll keep you posted, though. 1y

Butterfinger I didn't know. I purchased the book from thrift books last year because I thought it was a King Arthur retell. I have not read it yet. Thank you for sharing. I think I might use it to start a fire. I don't want to donate it and I am not keeping it. No. 1y

GingerAntics @Butterfinger well, it is that. It‘s a bad one because she clearly has no idea what she‘s talking about. It could be used to start a slightly destructive fire, and I‘d be okay with it. For example, to burn down the club house at mar a lago, and the neighbourhood would applaud I think. 🤷🏼‍♀️ No one would get hurt, but it would make for great TV. (edited) 1y

Butterfinger I'm glad you said something. I don't want my money to go to the abuse of children. I consider myself a modern day abolitionist because NC is so heavy with the sex trade and labor slavery, which includes children. I go around leaving phone numbers in the interstate restrooms for this purpose and MY money went to that woman. I'm disgusted. 1y

Butterfinger Thank you for putting this out there. And, I am sorry you had to relive memories and past hurts. 1y

GingerAntics @Butterfinger you and me both. I can‘t believe people involved in this madness, a woman who knew about this, is still being allowed to make money off of this. It‘s disgusting. It‘s amazing the number of people who donated money they got from working with her to RAINN and other sex abuse charities. That was good to see. 1y

GingerAntics @Butterfinger I honestly thought everyone was either going to already know or insist on separating the creator from the creation. 1y

Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick I'm sorry this brought up those bad memories. I know that historically marriages happened young, but as you mentioned, calling them girl & child doesn't help, nor does going into detail. Even in 1983 I would imagine most people were uncomfortable and don't need those exact plot details. I had never heard of the allegations before and, while this wasn't really on my TBR list, it certainly isn't now. *hugs* 1y

GingerAntics @Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick it‘s certainly a disservice to the traditional/old ways and the people that still practice them. The book uses Wicca as opposed to the Celtic old ways, but this is also a disservice to Wicca. None of these belief systems condone (or ever have) sex between children and adults. That might be what angers me the most. 1y

Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick I know next to nothing about either religion, but I'm sure young & blood-related were NOT qualifications. Blech. Some people are gross and project that out. 1y

GingerAntics @Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick I don‘t know much about Wicca, but I do know the Celtic old ways. They are certainly more open about sex and teenagers with other teenagers is acceptable in safe situations, even today. Of course, they also stay within the confines of the law of the country they‘re in, so minors and adults are always off limits. Heck, Brehon law was the first European law system to make rape illegal and divorce for women an option. 1y

GingerAntics @Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick Brehon law even clearly protects children as well. I‘ve seen/read Wiccan groups actively fighting for protections for children and the rights of children. This was definitely some projecting. 1y

GingerAntics @InLibrisVeritas Thanks for letting me join your group on this book, but I‘m bowing out now on this one. Sorry to have you add me to the list and then take me off, but I just don‘t believe this book deserves the attention. 1y

InLibrisVeritas @GingerAntics I am so sorry this was something that brought up painful memories for you, there is no need for an apology. This was an issue I was unaware of when it won the poll, I will make more of an effort to vet each nominee and to add trigger warnings to the posts if I can. I will try to make a post soon regarding this, just in case others may want to bow out of reading it. I am again so very sorry. (edited) 1y

GingerAntics @InLibrisVeritas oh no, it‘s not your fault at all. For all the raves I heard about this book, no one ever mentioned this author or her husband. It‘s so weird. 🤷🏼‍♀️ I don‘t know how many people had already read it and weren‘t paying attention in 2014 when her daughter first went public or what. It seems either you know or you don‘t. 1y

GingerAntics @InLibrisVeritas There doesn‘t seem to be “oh I heard it was just rumours” or “I heard something about that and didn‘t put it together” or anything like that. There is just no middle ground. It‘s the best kept viral secret ever from the sounds of things. 🤷🏼‍♀️ I‘d gladly discuss what I read of the book, I just read so little I don‘t think I‘d have much to add to a discussion of it. 1y

Caroline2 NO!!! I had no idea the author was an abuser!!!! 🤦‍♀️ I must say, I was really enjoying the book (gross incest aside!). But now I don‘t know what to do?? I feel awful for reading on??? 😟 I totally agree that we need to hold authors accountable. Wish I‘d done my research before I started reading!!! 🤦‍♀️ 1y

GingerAntics @Caroline2 right? Are we supposed to Google every author before we read them? I actually did go Google the authors of all the books I was reading and the authors of the books I‘m about to order this month. 1y

21 likes38 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Aaaaand here‘s the incest. Just remember, this was a 15 or 16 year old girl coerced and tricked into having sex with her YOUNGER (11-13 year old) brother. Funny how that words out. That was Bradley‘s husband‘s preferred age range for “lovers” and about the time Bradley stopped molesting her daughter. Disgusting.
#MarionZimmerBradley #TheMistsOfAvalon #SciFiFantasyBookClub #BBBBC

Texreader, julesG, Bookwomble

TrishB I loved this book until I found out about the author and her husband 😡 1y

GingerAntics @TrishB these two were truly twisted human beings. I am utterly disgusted. 1y

TrishB I know people can separate the art from the person, but I can‘t with this. 1y

See All 9 Comments

GingerAntics @TrishB that was literally in my comments/review. I‘m open minded about separating the creation from the creator, but that ends at abuse of any kind for me, especially abuse of children. This is just deplorable. 1y

Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick I can overlook a few dumb comments or dissenting opinion but not molestation. Gross. 1y

GingerAntics @Kelly_the_Bookish_Sidekick right? There is just a limit here and Bradley blew right past that limit. 1y

Caroline2 @TrishB I wish I had known about the author before I started reading. 😢 It is all deeply disturbing!!!! 1y

TrishB @Caroline2 I nearly said something but I didn‘t know how to and don‘t like telling people what they should or shouldn‘t be reading. I‘d already read it when I found out. 😞 1y

Caroline2 @TrishB It‘s so difficult isn‘t it. But so awful. 1y

17 likes9 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Here it is, clear as day, in Bradley‘s own words. To think that this woman thought that a child opening her legs to a grown man is an “irresponsible force of nature.” Yeah, kids wrap their legs around adults when they‘re being carried or given a piggy back ride, but that‘s not naked and it‘s certainly not sex. This is.
#MarionZimmerBradley #TheMistsOfAvalon #SciFiFantasyBookClub #BBBBC

Texreader, julesG, Bookwomble

Texreader I read your links in the previous post. Tragic. So many people hurt so badly. 😭 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader it really is. For it to be open knowledge in their relationship for DECADES and the response is to move him to his own apartment?! So much that just blows the mind in this situation. 🤯 I feel better knowing. I think reading Moira‘s poetry really helped me, honestly. I would buy a book of that and support the ever loving 🤬 out of her. 1y

Caroline2 I am so embarrassed to admit that this scene didn‘t register with me?! I don‘t even remember this scene so I can only assume I skim read that part!! I am so angry with myself that I didn‘t pick up on this!!! 1y

GingerAntics @Caroline2 in all the things I read online, it seems this part slipped past a lot of people. I think it might have been the intent. The little girl is painted head to toe in blue, the MC is also painted in blue. The main story is not about this little girl. It‘s just slipped in. 1y

14 likes4 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

I know too much about the Celtic old ways to not roll my eyes at the obvious, complete lack of understanding of those ways by Bradley.

I currently plan to finish this book, just to say that I did, but time will tell. This is a really long book for all of this cluelessness.
#MarionZimmerBradley #TheMistsOfAvalon #SciFiFantasyBookClub #BBBBC

julesG I read it before I turned 20. So long before I knew anything about the Celts. I think this was for the better. 😂😂 1y

GingerAntics @julesG it‘s so utterly wrong and so utterly boring. I want to be able to say I‘ve read it, but this is a bloody door stop. 1y

Bookwomble I had 'Mists of Avalon" TBR for a long time, but chucked it in the recycling bin when I found out Bradley sexually abused her children. Separation of creator from creation is something to consider, but for me not possible in this case. 1y

See All 13 Comments

GingerAntics @Bookwomble I‘m currently at the section that she wrote peodophilea into the book. I‘m currently reading her daughter‘s heart wrenching accounts and trying to calm down enough that my comments are not completely expletive riddled. I can‘t separate creator from creation in this case either, especially because she didn‘t. It‘s right there in black and white for her to see. 1y

Texreader Holy moly that‘s a chunkster!!! 1y

Texreader @Bookwomble Say what??? 😡 I agree; that‘s hard to separate from the creation. 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader it really is a chunkster. Yeah, there is a scene where a 14 or 15 year old girl is forced to have sex with an “old man” (her description) and is coerced into doing it. She doesn‘t want to, but they tell her she has to in order to save Avalon. Such rubbish. She sexually abused both her children and other girls and boys. 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader She apparently tied her daughter to a chair and attacked her with a pair of pliers, threatening to pull out all of her teeth. She apparently held her head under water because she didn‘t want to be her mother‘s lover. Her father sexually abused 22 boys Moira knew about and named to the cops. Bradley said in court she felt the kids were old enough to make their own decisions. They were like 10-12. 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader When Bradley‘s son was 15 she finally thought to ask him if his father ever tried to have sex with him (she knew about his peodophilea before they were married) and the son said “I‘m too old for him now.” 🤬🤦🏼‍♀️🥃 The whole thing is EPHED UP!!! 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader this is the link to the original blog post that broke the story, including emails and two poems directly from Moira Greyland. https://deirdre.net/2014/06/10/marion-zimmer-bradley-its-worse-than-i-knew/ 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader I read excerpts from her testimony at her own husband‘s trial for sex with a minor, and seriously this woman is TWISTED!!! Here is a link to her deposition (I read the excerpt version) and the deposition of her lover and the person now benefiting from Bradley‘s estate (I didn‘t read that one). These people are disgusting. “Children don‘t have erogenous zones” was possibly the most insane thing I ever heard. 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader http://www.marionzimmerbradley.com or this one just to jump to the excepts https://deirdre.net/marion-zimmer-bradley-excerpted-testimony/ this takes a strong stomach, honestly. (edited) 1y

GingerAntics @Texreader can you guess what I‘ve been reading all day? I feel like I should get some page count credit for this or something. 1y

15 likes13 comments

Caroline2

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#weeklyforecast
Even tho I‘m only up to page 266 and it‘ll prob take all month to read, I‘m really enjoying Mists. It‘s so immersive, with the perfect blend of fantasy and history and beautiful writing. #bbbbc #scififantasybookclub
Hoping to finish Piranesi this week but with so much homeschooling to do I‘m getting very little time to read. 🙄 #buddyread

rockpools, Oryx, scripturient, TrishB, julesG, squirrelbrain

julesG Homeschooling 🥴🙄 not looking forward to tomorrow - have to juggle two kids; and the cleaning lady, who can only visit between 8 and 10am. 🙄🙄🙄 Fingers crossed for smooth sailing. 🤞 1y

rockpools @caroline2 @julesG Good luck, both of you! I think I need to stop stacking books - I‘m looking at Mists of Avalon now, thinking ‘that sounds great!‘ 1y

Caroline2 @rockpools It‘s so good. One of those big, dense books that you just want to go to bed with tea and snacks and read all day. 😆 1y

See All 9 Comments

Crazeedi Mists is one of my top 10 all time favorites. Read it many years ago. It is one of the best for arthurian stories. I never reread, but I may have to break that tradition 1y

squirrelbrain There‘s no rush on Piranesi - there‘s another few weeks before our Zoom. Good luck with the homeschooling! 1y

Caroline2 @Crazeedi It‘s so good isn‘t it. I‘m really enjoyed it. I don‘t reread either but this is such a rich, deep story I think it would hold up to being reread. 👍 1y

Clare-Dragonfly Mists is one of my favorite books. 🥰🌕🌑 1y

Kdgordon88 Mists has been on my shelf forever. I really need to read it one of these days. 1y

Crazeedi @Kdgordon88 oh my, you DEFINITELY need to read! It is a magnificent book 1y

104 likes1 stack add9 comments

kgriffith

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

I just listened to/read this a couple of years ago but I don‘t at all remember being so contemptuous of Guinevere as I feel on this re-listen. I was very empathetic at first bc I saw in her some CPTSD stuff, but the hyper religious response is triggering me in a whole other way.

27 likes1 stack add

InLibrisVeritas @4thhouseontheleft @ABooksyGirl @ahackett @amyg @Angeles @Ashley_Nicoletto @BarbaraTheBibliophage @BethM @BrittanyReads @Bturner588 @Bookgirl @bookwormAHN @bookandcat @Captain22 @caroline2 @CBee @cewilf @cherinium @Chrissyreadit @cobwebmoth @CoffeeK8 @coffeewithbooks @daena @DannyHattan @debiw781 @DuckOfDoom @eanderson @eri.reads @erhibiscus @Eyelit @Fantasyfan @Gezemice @grrlbrarian @HufflepuffGirl90 @InBooksILive 1y

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#BBBBC

It's time for the first read of 2021! We will be reading The Mists of Avalon in Jan and Feb!

Please let me know if you want to join or if you plan to skip this one so I can add you to the notification list for this read.

#scififantasybookclub

InLibrisVeritas @thearcherisagirl @thereadingunicorn @TheRomantiCate @TheSpineView @TK421 @tonyahoswalt @Tracyantoon @wanderinglynn 1y

See All 18 Comments

Schnoebs Definitely interested in picking this one up 👍 1y

SherylRC Definitely excited about this read 😊 Have already started. 1y

IndoorDame I‘m interested in joining this one 😊 1y

BookwormAHN I'm planning a rereading 😺 1y

AnansiGirl Could you tag me in the BBBBC? I‘ve been wanting to join for several months, just kept forgetting to ask. 😊 (edited) 1y

Tracyantoon I am skipping this one. But hoping to be back for the March book!! 1y

MeganAnn This has been on my shelf for years! Happy to finally have a reason forcing me to pick it up. I‘m still working on finishing A Memory Called Empire.... hopefully I can finish it soon and get started on this one since it‘s such a chunkster! 1y

Riveted_Reader_Melissa I‘m planning on reading this one, I have it in paperback waiting. 1y

GingerAntics I already started this one. 1y

Nute I love this book. I hope that I know where my copy is so that I can join in.👍🏽 1y

InLibrisVeritas @AnansiGirl Absolutely! 1y

InLibrisVeritas @Tracyantoon No problem! I will take you off the notifcation list for Mists 💜 1y

Caroline2 I‘ve started and loving it so far! 😯 ❤️ 1y

Angeles Hi, I will pass on this one 1y

Gezemice I am reading this one, it has been on my list for a long time! 1y

26 likes18 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

I‘ve done the math. If I read 17 pages a day, I‘ll be done by 25 February, in just enough time for the discussion.
#MarionZimmerBradley #TheMistsOfAvalon #SciFiFantasyBookClub #BBBBC

Caroline2 Oh I just started this last night too. 😀 1y

GingerAntics @Caroline2 this has been on my iPad for ages. I‘ve always put it off because of the length, but when others were reading it in January and February, it seemed the perfect time to finally read it. How are you liking it so far? 1y

Caroline2 Yes! I‘ve had it on my shelf for a couple of years now and the size is very intimidating! I love your 27pages a day idea tho! 😀 good thinking! I‘m really liking it although I‘m already struggling trying to remember who is who! 🙄 1y

See All 7 Comments

GingerAntics @Caroline2 yeah, 17 pages a day seems far more manageable than looking at the whole book. There are A LOT of women so far. I‘m glad I‘m not the only one struggling to keep track, especially when some of the women have very similar names. 1y

GingerAntics @Caroline2 I just read the first chapter and I‘m already ahead of the daily 17 pages, so I‘m feeling far more confident about this now. 1y

Caroline2 😆 that‘s good! 👍 1y

JazzFeathers This was once one of my favourite books. Been ages since last l read it. 1y

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Hazel2019

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

My #Jolabokaswap package from @faelinwolf that showed up today to complete the Christmas Eve experience. Thank you so much @faelinwolf ! Love it 🥰 🎄 🎁 ❄️

MaleficentBookDragon

Caroline2 Oh! We‘re having a read along with this in January if you fancy it? 😀 #bbbbc #scififantasybookclub (edited) 2y

Hazel2019 @Caroline2 yes! Do I need to do anything to join?? 2y

faelinwolf Yay! I'm so glad it FINALLY got here & just in time! 🎄❤️🎄Also super excited for you to join the read along. 😄 2y

Caroline2 I don‘t think so? @InLibrisVeritas can you tag @Hazel2019 for the readalong please? 😀 👍 2y

InLibrisVeritas @Caroline2 Absolutely! 😊 2y

67 likes5 comments

StaceGhost

Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

pick

@Lynnsoprano @Scochrane26 @readingwino @Lollymya @Catsandbooks @Bookishlie @CaliforniaCay enjoying the Xmas cheer 🧑‍🎄#holidaycardswap #litsylove

27 likes

InLibrisVeritas @IndoorDame @janjan @jazzfeathers @jpmcwisemorgan @Laughterhp @Lesanne @leshamac @lildeb_8 @LittleBug @madamereginald @manifestsanity @MeganAnn @miralunasbooknook @mreads @mutlee @OnePageAtATime @phatsallylee @RainyDayReading @ReadingBetween @Riveted_Reader_Melissa @RJHowe @SamAnne @Schnoebs @sebrittain @shaunseay @Shadowfat @Soscha
@sophoclessweetheart @swatreads 2y

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#BBBBC

We have our Fantasy pick for January and Feburary, The Mists of Avalon by Marion Zimmet Bradley!

The Mists of Avalon is a retelling of Arthurian legend through the eyes of the women behind the throne.

Will you be joining us for this one?

#scififantasybookclub

InLibrisVeritas @thearcherisagirl @thereadingunicorn @TheRomantiCate @TheSpineView @TK421 @tonyahoswalt @Tracyantoon @wanderinglynn @wordslinger42 2y

See All 27 Comments

Riveted_Reader_Melissa Yes, I‘ve had this one sitting on my bookshelf for a long time. #MtTBR 2y

Schnoebs Even though I didn‘t pick it, I‘m pretty excited for it 2y

CBee I read this years ago and it was fantastic! 2y

BookwormAHN I read this a few years ago but I'm looking forward to rereading it 💜 2y

Nute I love this book! Please add me to the SciFi Book Club Membership and tag list. I‘m excited about more opportunities to read Fantasy and Science Fiction Literature! 2y

Caroline2 YAY!! 😀 Count me in! I‘ve had this on my shelf for yearsss! Looking forward to this in Jan! 👍 2y

imyril No thanks. Please can you untag me from the club? 2y

InLibrisVeritas @imyril Sure!! ❤ 2y

InLibrisVeritas @Nute Added and welcome! ❤ 2y

wordslinger42 I'm going to sit this one out! 2y

IndoorDame Yes! This one has been on my TBR for access! 2y

TheSpineView Excited about this one! 2y

MeganAnn I‘m in! I‘ve also had this on my shelf for years... love the movie so much but I‘ve never gotten around to reading the book. ❤️ 2y

BethM Yes! 2y

GingerAntics This has been on my TBR for ages!!! I‘m always looking for the right time to read it. Perhaps this is what I was waiting for! 🤷🏼‍♀️ 2y

RainyDayReading I‘ll be passing on this one. I‘ve read some interesting things regarding the author and some of the content of her books and it‘s not really someone I want to support/read. But I hope you all enjoy it! I‘ll jump back in with the next round 😁 2y

InLibrisVeritas @RainyDayReading I just looked into her, and I truly had no idea. Thank you for the heads up, and I totally understand. 2y

RainyDayReading @InLibrisVeritas Yeah it‘s not really well known anymore. I stumbled upon it completely by accident a couple years ago. Can‘t wait to join in with the next one! 2y

Bookgirl I read this book years ago and loved it! As far as the author...yikes. There‘s a long and twisted tale of abuse by her, which really stinks as this book is such a lovely tale of female empowerment. 2y

InLibrisVeritas @Hazel2019 Here is info the Mists read in Jan and Feb! We read a new book every 2 months, and alternate between Fantasy and Sci-fi. You can recommend books at anytime and they go into a random draw, which I pull from to make the voting poll. If you have any questions please let me know 💜 2y

Hazel2019 Thank you @InLibrisVeritas ! I‘ll be planning on joining 😊 2y

SherylRC I would love to join in on the read, one of my all time fav books😊 very excited. 2y

InLibrisVeritas @SherylRC I will add you to the list!! Welcome! 1y

SherylRC @InLibrisVeritas thank you 😊 1y

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BacklistReader

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#unreadandontheshelf

What can I say....I like big books. We‘ll see if I get to any of these soon.

Do you what thoughts about any of these? What are they?

AllisonM89 I started Mists of Avalon and really liked it, but need to get back to it. Things were just to crazy to find the time to get through it. 2y

BacklistReader @AllisonM89 That‘s good to know. It‘s one of the books I‘m really excited for and really want to read but never pick for some reason. (edited) 2y

wanderinglynn Anna Karenina is on my TBR too. 2y

See All 6 Comments

MsMelissa I loved The Mists of Avalon. 2y

BacklistReader @wanderinglynn you‘ll have to let me know how you like it if you get to it before me 🤣 2y

BacklistReader @Book_Fiend_Melissa King Arthur is one of my favorites and this being from a different point of view is very intriguing to me. 2y

10 likes6 comments

BacklistReader

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Skyscraper by Demi Lovato

Make a Book Stack!

Maybe these books will be read soon?! 🤷‍♀️

#beatthebacklist #beatthebacklist2020 #btbjuly20

9 likes

Crazeedi

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

#7Books7Days- #day3
Books that made an impact on me

Nute Love love love this book!💕 2y

Suet624 Oh yes!! 2y

Crazeedi @Nute @Suet624 🥰 2y

58 likes3 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

so-so

2020 Read Harder Challenge, book 17
Prompt: Read a doorstopper (over 500 pages) published after 1950, written by a woman
WOOF. I adore Arthurian legend, and a femme Pagan retelling seemed like something I‘d obviously love. And while the writing was incredible, it was the perfect storm of challenges for me—especially because betrayal was such a relentless theme. I‘m glad to HAVE READ it, but the process of reading it was pretty unpleasant for me.

23 likes

Mtroiano

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

A little over halfway through and I am loving this book. The size is intimidating but it is easy to get lost and read hundreds of pages at a time.

Caroline2 Ohh I‘ve had this on my tbr shelf for a while now. Might be time to move it up the pile. 👍 2y

JazzFeathers It was one of my favourites when l was a kid. 2y

39 likes2 comments

Mtroiano

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Another one that‘s been sitting on my shelf forever that I‘m finally starting to read.

Social distancing day 26

Andrew65 And mine! 2y

JazzFeathers Oh my goodness! That's a read from my childhood! 2y

JamieArc Same here! It‘s one of my goals to read it this year. 2y

46 likes3 comments

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

1. Aching. 2. I found out about bookshop.org and I wanted to support the cause even though I prefer ebooks mostly! So I ordered two physical books that will satisfy Read Harder prompts from there. :) tags to anyone who wants to participate!

15 likes

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

Quarantine reads challenge
1. The Mists of Avalon by Marion Zimmer Bradley
2. Can‘t pick one, but the first that comes to mind is The Gammage Cup by Carol Kendall
3. Charis Books and More is an AMAZING feminist bookstore in Atlanta!
4. The Inkheart trilogy by Cornelia Funke
5. Good Omens and The Last Unicorn are tied for me.
6. The second and third Murderbot books are staring at me currently. Gotta finish Mists first, though! (More in comments)

UnRuLee 7. More Than Human FOR SURE. I want to be part of a Gestalt.
8. Not to be a broken record, but More Than Human. I was not expecting to love it as fiercely as I do.
9. I want to complete the Read Harder Challenge (I‘m getting close!) and read at least 75 books total.
10. I love reading by water.
11. One of the first I remember loving (and still love) is the Hobbit.
12. Tag you‘re it, @elliebookmaster! Welcome to Litsy!
2y

12 likes1 comment

The Mists of Avalon | Marion Zimmer Bradley

“A Druid in training must be a bard before he is a priest, for music is one of the keys to the laws of the universe.”

10 likes